But with the Ring he would be so powerful that it didn't matter if he had a physical form or not. Lantarion no house. Great post before, Niniel; but I have to disagree with your last one.
As far as the testimony of Gollum goes, Sauron had fingers, and therefore a physical form, during the War of the Ring. But I think the quote provided by Niniel is quite clear: Sauron's complete power was linked to, or rather contained within, the One Ring , and he could not use his magical powers to full capacity without it. Sauron did not need the Ring to overcome Middle- earth, he needed to stop other people from getting it and using it for that pupose. Unfortunately for him, the good side did not intend to use the Ring, but to destroy it.
What the enemy least suspects. He had a physical form before he forgded the ring right? Eriol Estel. This is an instance in which I think the movie was confusing. Sauron was just plain killed by Elendil , Gil-Galad and Isildur. It was not like it was pictured, a lucky stab by Isildur at a healthy Sauron. Isildur is said I think, I'm not sure to have delivered the death blow, but surely Gil-Galad and Elendil did more than their share of wounds to the old fella.
After his death his spirit departed and waited a long time before building a new body, no doubt because of lack of power. Since he left voluntarily that body, he was able to form a new one in no time.
At Isildur's hand, he was forced to leave the body, because of his wounds. So Isildur just grabbed the Ring out of a dead Sauron's hand. Beleg Fading. L Lets clear our facts. Firstly the concept of Spirits is not very clear in Tolkien 's Mythology.
Tolkien i think has never described the battle between Elendil , Ereniel and Isuldur. I believe that when Isuldur cut the ring from his finger, To cut the ring, the Finger of Sauron needs to be solid. I am not implying that during the battle Sauron was as princely and as wise looking as he was when he manipulated Hollin's folks. But i think that as Suaron produced the ring by adding his own malicious essence in the form of enchantments, whenever he wore it the nothingliness of his evil power got stronger for most of his power returned to him and he was able to solidfy his mere phantom self.
For it is said that after the drowning of numenor Sauron could never take a shape seeming fair to look upon. Since The malice and Power of Sauron was increasing and the dread of Sauron was spreading everywhere, his corrupted soul was gaining more energy.
Sauron feeds on fear and the self belief in himself that he would sooner or later, after seeing the dwindling power of Gondor and Arnor gain the control of Middle earth , strengthened and by pure self will he was able to give his nothingly form a shape. Anyway anything visible needs to have some kind of Shape and maybe Gollum being in quarter wraith world was able to see more of him then a normal middle earth being.
His physical form was lost in the Drowning of Numenor. People tend to forget this. It is clearly stated that Isuldur cut the ring from Sauron's finger. Actually as Niniel has described before, being a body of corrupted mind, he could fathom the way justice and truth works. His mind had become so evil that it brought others on his own scales and he judged the others as not bearers of peace but people like him, lesser maybe but still seeking power. He was so caught up in Evil that he for even one moment didn't thought that sometimes Power isn't the most deadly weapon.
Actually, Physcial form to Sauron would be like Passing of a summer to Elves. While Judging this we bring everything to the current world standard, forgetting that Tolkien's middle earth is quiet different. Sauron's purpose was to call himself the King of Middle Earth and to Corrupt everything good.
While as for the matter of shape, Tolkien implies that fair shape comes from fair deeds. If one's heart is filled with evil his physcial features would also change. And In Tolkien's world, fairness is assosiated with Lightside. I guess even Frodo and Sam with their depleted power would be able to kill two Simple Orcs. Blueduindain Made in Gondor. It was because he placed most of his soul into the ring ; when it was destroyed there went most of his soul. One of the things that had to be done was bind it's soul into an object.
The lich will remain "Alive", so long as the phylactery is intact. If the phylactery is destroyed, than so is the lich. Now obviously Sauron is not a lich, but it is a good analogy, for you see, the ring is kind of like his phylactery; which is why those that have it get possessed.
As mentioned at the beginning of The Fellowship of The Ring the first film in the trilogy by Galadriel, nineteen rings were originally made, known as The Rings of Power. What Fellowship leaves out is the fact that the rings were crafted by Elven-smiths after they were taught by a being called Annatar — who was really Sauron, the Dark Lord and ruler of Mordor, in disguise.
The nineteen rings were an attempt by Sauron at bringing the races of Middle Earth to evil and were distributed among them. Without telling anyone, Sauron returned to Mordor and forged what would become the most powerful ring in all of Middle-Earth — The One Ring. Due to the way in which The Ring was created, the only way it can be truly destroyed is if it is thrown back into the fires of Mount Doom. Gollum lost the game but had no intention of letting Bilbo leave. He went to retrieve the Ring in order to use its powers of invisibility to help him kill Bilbo, but flew into a rage when he found it missing.
Deducing that Bilbo had it from his last question— "What have I got in my pocket? At one point as he neared the exit, Bilbo was presented with an opportunity to easily kill Gollum, but relented out of pity for Gollum's wretched condition. Bilbo escaped Gollum and the Orcs that inhabited the Misty Mountains by remaining invisible, and told a falsified account of his adventures to Thorin 's company and Gandalf , claiming he had been very agile in the dark and escaped the goblins.
Gandalf , who was also travelling with the Dwarves, was suspicious of Bilbo's story and of the Ring itself, which he immediately recognized as one of the Great Rings of Power due to the retarding effects it had had on Gollum's aging process. Some few years after Bilbo's return to the Shire, Gandalf managed to coerce from Bilbo the real story of how the Ring had come into his possession. The truth, as it turned out, had been quite innocent and was so similar to Bilbo's fabrication that Gandalf saw no real reason why Bilbo would have lied about his story in the first place, save perhaps to put his claim to the Ring beyond any possible doubt.
Gandalf quickly came to believe that the Ring had an "unwholesome" effect on its owner that set to work almost immediately, as it was not in Bilbo's nature to lie, particularly regarding something so apparently trivial. However, he saw no real danger in letting Bilbo keep the Ring despite the Hobbit's strangely possessive attitude towards it. In the sixty years that Bilbo had the ring he seldom used it, although he kept it on his person at all times.
This lack of use meant its malign effects were slow to take hold, the most noticeable being that Bilbo retained a relatively young appearance even past years old.
In TA , Bilbo concocted a plan to leave the Shire for Rivendell , and both he and Gandalf had initially intended for Bilbo's nephew and adopted heir Frodo to inherit both Bilbo's estate and the Ring. As the time came for Bilbo to give it up however, he became extremely reluctant to pass the Ring to his nephew, and his obstinacy over the issue led Gandalf to confront him directly about the Ring.
At this point, though Gandalf did not yet know exactly what the Ring was, he could tell that it was both evil and gaining a great deal of influence over his old friend. As such, he advised Bilbo in the strongest terms to give the Ring to Frodo. After a short, angry debate, Bilbo calmed down and managed to give up the Ring of his own free will. He then departed from the Shire, and Frodo came into possession of the Ring. However, Bilbo's strangely hostile reaction to giving up the Ring had greatly disturbed Gandalf.
Troubled by both his encounter with Bilbo and recent events in the world at large, Gandalf began to consider the possibility that the Ring might be more dangerous than he had first believed. He initially considered revealing his concerns to Saruman , the head of the White Council and the Istari. However, having grown wary of Saruman's pride, he decided to keep his own counsel for the time being. Instead, he considered finding and interrogating Gollum in order to help him further understand the nature of the Ring.
He searched for news of Gollum, and managed to determine that Gollum had indeed left the Misty Mountains to locate the Ring. However, lulled by the fact that Saruman had revealed to the White Council on at least one occasion that the Ring was beyond finding, he decided to let Gollum be. This proved to be an unfortunate oversight on Gandalf's part, because Gollum's long possession of the Ring had incidentally left him open to a mental summons from Sauron, who was putting forth his power to draw as many evil beings as possible to Mordor to rebuild his forces.
As such, Gollum was pulled away from his search for the Shire and came at last to Mordor. Here, Sauron too recognized the effects of a Ring of Power on Gollum. As the other Rings were all accounted for, being in his possession, destroyed, or in the hands of the Elves, he knew that Gollum must have at some point possessed the One. Under torture, Gollum revealed the existence of Bilbo and the Shire.
Now extremely worried, Gandalf decided at last to locate Gollum. Gandalf requested of his close friend Aragorn that he should aid him in a hunt for Gollum.
However, as Gollum was at the time in Sauron's custody, his search was in vain. After months of fruitless wandering, Gandalf gave up on finding Gollum, leaving the seemingly hopeless search to Aragorn. Desperate for information, Gandalf realized while thinking of Saruman's ring-lore that the only source from which he could have obtained his knowledge was some sort of account left by Isildur, as he was the only person ever to have possessed the Ring besides Sauron.
Gandalf then traveled to Minas Tirith in search of any records Isildur might have left behind concerning the Ring. After a thorough search, he finally came across a short manuscript by Isildur concerning the Ring's properties, including an important note that the Ring, when made hot, seemed to manifest fiery writing upon its outer band. Armed with this knowledge, Gandalf began a return trek to the Shire when he learned that, against all odds, Aragorn had somehow managed to find and capture Gollum.
Gollum then revealed that he had been to Mordor, and that Sauron now knew virtually everything that Gandalf knew about the Ring's location. Gandalf then hastened to the Shire and confirmed his suspicions; the Ring was indeed the One. Knowing that Sauron would use every means at his disposal to get it back, Gandalf instructed Frodo to flee to Rivendell with it, as it was the closest safe haven.
Gandalf had intended to accompany them, but was lured to Isengard and imprisoned by Saruman, who wanted the location of the Ring so that he could take it for himself.
Before he had departed however, he had given a letter to Mr. Butterbur , the innkeeper of the Prancing Pony in Bree with instructions that it was to be delivered to Frodo immediately.
The letter contained a warning to Frodo that he needed to leave the Shire at once, and had also contained a bit of information about Aragorn, whom Gandalf had instructed to watch for the hobbits and aid them if he could.
However, the letter was never delivered, and as such, Frodo delayed his departure in the hopes that Gandalf was simply late. Eventually however, Frodo decided that he could no longer wait, and with his companions, Samwise Gamgee , Peregrin Took , and Meriadoc Brandybuck set out without him for Rivendell. The Hobbits' delay, however, had allowed Sauron's servants, a number of strange black-clad horsemen , to journey to the Shire and begin searching for the Ring.
The hobbits had a few close encounters with these black riders, but managed to stay out of their grasp. Within a few days, they reached the village of Bree and encountered Aragorn, who revealed to them that he knew of their quest and was a friend of Gandalf's.
He offered to guide them to Rivendell, but the hobbits were wary of his intentions. Fortunately however, Butterbur revealed Gandalf's letter to the hobbit party and they accepted his offer. By then, Gandalf had managed to escape from Isengard, and had begun desperately seeking for Frodo. What is the reason for this?
He was still able to be destroyed when he had the ring, simply by having it cut from his hand. Is it the fact that his powers greatly increase while having the ring, and if so, what are those powers that increase?
Of course, neither of these worked out too well - the Elves were aware of him and simply took them off, and he didn't really have a pressing need to enhance his already tremendous power to dominate the minds and wills of his servants.
Sauron already has the military might to overwhelm Middle-Earth. Remember that in Sauron's initial, unprepared assault, Gondor almost fell, as described in the book. Battle of Dale. Many Dwarves and Men take refuge in Erebor and are besieged. Though grievous harm was done to the fair woods on the borders, the assaults were driven back.
The realm of Thranduil was invaded, and there was long battle under the trees and great ruin of fire; but in the end Thranduil had the victory. For a little space you may triumph on the field, for a day. But against the Power that now arises there is no victory. To this City only the first finger of its hand has yet been stretched. The next will be greater. This war then is without final hope, as Denethor perceived.
Victory cannot be achieved by arms, whether you sit here to endure siege after siege, or march out to be overwhelmed beyond the River. The reason Sauron needed the Ring was because it was the only route by which his enemies could stop him. If the Ring was claimed and used, or though he did not even imagine it destroyed, Sauron would lose and be destroyed.
But to achieve this he had been obliged to let a great part of his own inherent power a frequent and very significant motive in myth and fairy-story pass into the One Ring.
While he wore it, his power on earth was actually enhanced. But even if he did not wear it, that power existed and was in 'rapport' with himself: he was not 'diminished'. Unless some other seized it and became possessed of it. If that happened, the new possessor could if sufficiently strong and heroic by nature challenge Sauron, become master of all that he had learned or done since the making of the One Ring, and so overthrow him and usurp his place.
This was the essential weakness he had introduced into his situation in his effort largely unsuccessful to enslave the Elves, and in his desire to establish a control over the minds and wills of his servants.
And indeed, in the Lord of the Rings, Sauron accelerated his assault on Middle-Earth because he was afraid that Aragorn had the Ring, and he wanted to seize it as soon as possible, before Aragorn could master the Ring, or even worse, before someone like Galadriel or Gandalf took it, who could have used it to even greater effect.
But as the above quote from Letters illustrates, the lack of it did not make him any weaker; he is simply "enhanced", better able to use the powers he has.
Sauron is not invincible with it, he just needs it because without it, someone else could use it to defeat him. As a side-note, cutting off the Ring probably did not kill Sauron in the book - he had already been defeated and simply chose to abandon his body once the Ring was taken and his body was irrecoverably damaged. See my answer here:. Why did Sauron blow up if he only had his fingers cut off?
I don't know what makes you say that it was necessary. I don't see anything that indicates that: as you say, he had his own power, plus all his armies and the Nazgul. Indeed, it's clear that he had been planning his return to power and his war against the West for a long time before he knew the Ring had been found, and the lack of it was no bar to his plans.
However, once he knew it had been found, he naturally had to try and get it for himself, both because the extra power would help him in his plans, and because he feared what his enemies could do if they mastered it.
You're asking a logical question that can't really be satisfactorily answered because the answer itself is nonsense even within the rules established by the author. Sauron was a Maia, an angelic being that is lesser in stature and power than a Vala, but still of infinitely greater power than any being of flesh and blood, whether man or elf or dwarf. Consequently, that a man or an elf, or a whole host of these, could overcome or vanquish a Maia is, at its foundation, a ludicrous idea.
It would be like asking how an army of men could kill a single angel. An angel or a Maia whatever you want to call it is, for all intents and purposes, the equivalent of God Himself when it comes to the idea of a flesh-and-blood being fighting it.
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